Last night I was perusing some blogs and found a link to the post, "intolerance and infertility," which resides outside of the IF community on a blog called Thinking Girl. In essence the post was a plea for information (which I admire). The author was curious as to why infertile individuals are willing to face so many physical and emotional challenges in order to have biological children. In her opinion, this is a selfish and narcissistic act considering the number of children in the world who are without parents and could benefit from adoption. (Note: this is a gross oversimplification of the post, you should really check it out for yourself)The post generated a few ignorant responses, but on the whole, it is an interesting and engaging discourse. Reading through the comments felt a bit like sitting in on a college semin
ar. There were those individuals (like the author of the blog), who seemed genuinely interested in learning from others. The "pseudo-intellects" who are engaged in the conversation and use all the right "buzz words," but really only skimmed the readings. The "zealots" who feel compelled to profess their (conservative or liberal) doctrinal beliefs, but lack any capacity for critical thought. The "pundits" who are quick to express their opinions as fact, but whose claims are unsubstantiated or based solely on circumstantial evidence. And finally, the "class clowns" who wake up briefly to relate the discussion to whatever they saw on T.V. last night, before drifting back to sleep. (FYI, I generally played the role of the "pseudo-intellect" during college, with a dash of punditism for good measure)Overall, it was one of the most engaging threads that I have encountered on the net. This really is the internet at its' best.
I did want to comment/expand upon one of the points that was made, but my thoughts don't really contribute to the thread so I have decided to do so here. Furthermore, the Thinking Girl blog is intended as a forum for, "women, feminists, and feminist allies." While I do consider myself to be in solidarity with feminists on most issues, I also recognize that I do represent a "privileged" voice and so I will respectfully refrain from participating on this particular blog.
In the thread, one of the readers challenged to author to explain what she meant when she said the the nature of infertility treatments "bugs" her. The author responding with the following.
what bugs me about the nature of fertility treatments is two-fold - that they are highly invasive, and that the woman bears the entire burden (unless you call watching some porn and jerking off into a cup a burden). It is the woman’s body that becomes medicalized, even when the fertility problem is low sperm count. It is her body that is subjected to daily injections, hormonal fluctuations, procedures to extract eggs, procedures to implant sperm, procedures to implant fertilized eggs, and sometimes procedures to minimize the number of fetuses she carries to term.
I agree with much of what the author has written here. The one caveat being the assumption that all fertility treatments are the solely the woman's burden. There are certainly a number of treatments (hormone therapy, varicocele repair) that are male oriented. Perhaps, she is only concerned with the IUI/IVF treatments? But I digress, I do think (based on zero evidence) that doctor's ar
e too quick to push IVF/ICSI in the case of male infertility when other treatments may be viable options. I would imagine that this is done in the spirit of efficiency, but it raises some serious concerns regarding the way that women are treated in our society. Since society promotes an expectation of "woman as mother," the burden too frequently falls on their shoulders. I would be very curious to know how much money is spent on medical research regarding male infertility versus something like hair loss or erectile dysfunction? I am willing to bet that the latter two receive far more funding.The author's point about the woman's body being "medicalized" is also an important one. One implication of attempting to "fix" infertility is that "motherhood" is normalized, excluding those who cannot or do not wish to reproduce. I would imagine that this leaves many women feeling like "damaged goods" (a feeling that I can relate to with regard to IF). I have certainly heard many stories from my wife where she felt that she was more "object" than "subject" during various exams.
All of that being said, I was a little taken aback by the quote, "unless you call watching some porn and jerking off into a cup a burden." Obviously, you cannot even begin to compare the experiences of men and women when it comes to reproduction. Men simply have no idea wh
at it must feel like to sustain a life throughout the gestation period. However, I think that
the way in which the role of the man is diminished in this process helps to reinforce patriarchal views that are damaging to the feminist cause. In a society where the burden of child care and other domestic responsibilities continues to be the domain of the woman, despite increased participation in the workforce, we must ask ourselves why some men feel that their contribution ends at orgasm? Yes, many men simply seek to maximize and take advantage of their "male privilege," but why do they do this? We need to consider how men are conditioned to see their role in child rearing. Too often, involved males are either portrayed as beleaguered martyrs or simply as jokes. When the role of the male in the reproduction process is diminished are we simply stating a biological fact, or might we be contributing to the reinforcement of social norms that are damaging to women. While I have certainly made my fair share of "masturbation" jokes on this blog, I guess I never really considered the implications of these depictions on our definitions of "fatherhood." Personally, moving forward I am going to think about how I might become more involved during my wife's future pregnancy (fingers crossed) so that "parenting" is a truly shared venture from the start.
* note, I wanted to give credit to Kristen at The Sticky Bean (see blog roll) for her initial link to "Thinking Girl" and thank her for her post on that site regarding some important IF issues (including the burden of male IF).


12 comments:
I hope I did not come across as a pseudo-intellect or a class clown. LOL Before I wrote my post, I had to calm down because I have a habit of getting emotional (damn hormones!) and taking things entirely too personally.
As far as the woman carrying the burden for the vast majority of treatment, I personally believe this is a biological issue. There is no amount of feminist philosophy that can change that fact that I have a uterus, fallopian tubes, ovaries, etc. and my husband does not. In our situation, I have ovulatory dysfunction (and possibly more behind the scenes) so I do carry the entire burden. However, I had to speak up for men who suffer from MFI. The "jerking off into a cup" comment made me feel really sorry for men who have to go through just as much or more than the woman during IF treatment.
I did just come across an article on the overuse of ICSI in treatment of MF and I whole-heartedly agree with you that many doctors rush into that. It probably just raises their statistics to show more pregnancies/live births resulted as a result of their treatment.
Great post!
My husband gives me the shots. He goes to all the visits and holds my hand. He keeps me sane (a HUGE job) and he goes out and gets me ice cream when I want it...just to name a few things.
Overall, I'm better with physical pain than he is and I kinda feel like it is my due to go through all of this seeing as how easy it is for me to have multiple orgasms. Poor guy only gets one.
I so wanted to comment on her blog, and attempted too three times...but I kept coming across as the angry infertile that I am. So I stopped. Ignorance they say is bliss...so she must be very happy!
Hear, hear! It's very peculiar being part of the IF community when you're dealing with male-factor infertility. Would that my husband *could* fill a cup! That completely even denies the sacrifices that men make when using DI.
That said, we too have had a tough time balancing the involvement. I'm getting the drugs (and as a result, The Crazy) and have an intense number of appointments, but he comes to every single appointment that he can, and has never missed an IUI. And definitely what Heather said: he's keeping me sane.
What does your wife say? Is she the type to ask for help? I know I have a tough time asking for support. What kind of balance are you guys working out?
I love your blog. Just, you know, a little FYI. I'm not stalkery at ALL.
I just read the original post and skimmed the comments.
My feelings are that the author:
a. Doesn't like children
b. Has no concept of the difficulties of adoption
c. Doesn't see children as being an important part of society
I do agree with the author that IF treatments place the majority of the burden on the woman - certainly men can be supportive and do all they can to ease their partners' burden, but he can't take over the most invasive parts of the treatment, because of biology. However, I see the reason for this also as an issue of control, on the part of the doctors: When doing IVF/ICSI, they know exactly what is going on, down to the individual sperm. They know if fertilization occurred when it occurred, and how the embryo is growing, before they have to transfer the embryo to the woman for the still extremely mysterious part of implantation.
Like I said, what men can do, besides providing the necessary sample, is be there for support and helping with the procedures, although they can't actually do the procedures themselves. I may have to get the PIO shots, but it's my husband who gets to give them. I think like you said with parenthood, it assumed women will be great at the job, but men have to prove themselves. Her statement about jerking off demonstrates this. Maybe like you said too, that creates a greater barrier for men to expand their role in the domestic realm, because if people assume that they'll fail, why bother trying?
Thought-provoking post...I too read the post and its comments but was so ticked reading it that I know I couldn't post without sounding like a troll...I have the feeling that the author hasn't known much adversity in her life, or she would be more able to put herself in someone else's shoes...
I would like to add one more thing to the list of "pains that IF guys have to go through:" surgery to find out if there are any viable sperm in his body. Read allthosepills.blogspot.com to hear more about it. Ultimatejourney's husband went through hell before they finally proceeded to DI.
Great post, Frank.
So hard not to comment on her post--but I will be the better person and HOPE that if she ever does decide to have children, that she wont EVER have to go down the road we are on....
Ok, I briefly skimmed the article and I too was irritated. She was just stating her opinion (which of course she has the right to do), but she obviously doesn't know much about (in) fertility or adoption. What that chick didn't seem to understand is that if you would like to bring an INFANT into your family you don't have many options. As she so cavelierly states to just adopt one of the needy children. It is NOT that simple! I could go on and on about adoption and its difficulties, but I won't bore you. And placing the burden on the mother? I don't consider it a burden. I HAVE been through the wringer w/domestic adoption and am actually stepping back to try DI. My husband is devastated that he is unable to make me pregnant. It goes far beyond just wacking off in a cup...I think he would be thrilled if he could. He is with me every step of the way and cries along with me when I get frustrated.
I probably come off as a pseudo-intellectual, though I could go back and publish links to all my facts.
Thanks for the head's up. I added it to my blog as well. Enjoyed it thoroughly.
Hi Frank,
just wanted to let you know about the response post I wrote in follow-up to the post you linked to, because your post here was very helpful to me and I appreciated your perspective very much! you can read it (if you want to) here.
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